Is impossible really impossible?

General discussion. Please use this area for any off-topic discussion.
mbb
Posts:2
Joined:Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:42 am
Is impossible really impossible?

Postby mbb » Thu Jan 08, 2009 8:14 am

I love MOO2 and have been playing for years.

Even so impossible is a real bugger to beat.

I have had some success.

On a small galaxy, 8 players, pre-warp, playing fuedal + charismatic I can win! Yes it is true. If you can survive the first war then eventually you become everyone's buddy and they'll vote for you in the council.

Didn't feel like I had actually beat it like that so now I am playing huge galaxy, 8 players, pre-warp. This time I am avoiding the charismatic trait.

I have tried various mixes for the race but currently I am trying Unification, Creative, - spying and ground attack, repulsive and large home world.

Is it me or do the computer players tend to leave you alone when you are repulsive? Its so annoying to keep being framed :x

Anyway for those that are familiar must know that the form goes like this: Mad dash for planets; then try to close the tech gap which is impossible; careful playing to survive or live with the first war; someone declares war but cannot be resisted because they have too many ships and too good a tech.

Well, one strategy that seems to be working is to run up the Chemistry tech to Neutronium armour (that is the next one past zortium?). This gives tough ships and merculite missiles that can pack a good punch against low grade ships. Along the way I pick up Reasearh Lab, Automated factories, soil enrichment & sub-space comms. This buys enough time to consolidate as long as I start an early ship building program that uses the armour and missiles.

Now one thing is for sure. Only battleships count, supplemented by cruisers. Trying to build a fleet of destroyers (smaller for more numbers) won't work because they don't have the staying power. Especially against titans and doomstars :P

So after I have got to the techs for armour and missles I try to go for warp interdictors and beam technology. Warp interdictors are important to buy enough to deploy a large fleet to a system if it is attacked (forget going on the offensive).

Anyway I can't be sure but I think that going to Phasors seems to green light the AI to attack you. I think it is better to get to Warp Interdictors first, then get to the larger beam weapons.

Anyway thats where I am at for the time being. I would like to use this thread to build a list of dos and don'ts on Impossible. Thus:

1. Do get to Neutronium Armour as soon as possible.
2. Don't use destroyers.
3. Do get Warp Interdictor before Phasors.

Anyone have any more thoughts or ideas?

User avatar
Cabman
Posts:235
Joined:Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:58 pm
Location:Zabrze, Poland

Postby Cabman » Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:15 pm

We don't play AI in our games since it's to wimpy on any level. You should join our community and try several mp games. That should be enough to beat ai on any map or difficulty level.
Try this guide...it should help you at the begining.

mbb
Posts:2
Joined:Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:42 am

Postby mbb » Fri Jan 09, 2009 9:41 am

We don't play AI in our games since it's to wimpy on any level. You should join our community and try several mp games. That should be enough to beat ai on any map or difficulty level.
Try this guide...it should help you at the begining.
Well thanks for the reply. In of itself its not that much help for me - I am not going to play online due to time constraints and I play MOOII on my netbook on the train these days anyway.

I am not convinced that Impossible is as easy as you make out. There is a definite step increase between hard (which is no problem) and impossible. And even if you do find it that easy, then there may be others that may find a specific discussion for Impossible useful. Or in other words, things you can do if you think you are going to be under-pressure from a player like you :P

Anyway I have read the guide before, there is lots of good advice there. In some ways it reminds me of some things I had forgotten since I have returned from my latest haitus from the game. Mostly the stuff about production and tightly managing population to maximise it. But it is limited in its advice and perhaps isn't quite as generalised at it could be.

The only thing I will note for the time being is that making beam weaponry work is expensive both in research and cost. You need decent computers plus Structural Analysers and High Energy Focus to make them really effective against tough ships. And then you have to be able to load enough of them on a ship to be able to make a dent! Anyway I am not convinced that investing heavily in beam technology is the most cost effective. Late game maybe, but first I have to survive to the late game ...

User avatar
Matthew
Posts:186
Joined:Mon Mar 13, 2006 10:06 am

Postby Matthew » Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:43 pm

The AI is far from impossible. I've won without any good race picks and 8 players on impossible. All you need to do with beams to hit against the AI just use battle scanners and heavy beams.

toroloco
Posts:3
Joined:Sun Mar 01, 2009 12:03 am

Postby toroloco » Sun Mar 01, 2009 12:09 am

I've beaten it on Impossible Huge 8 players with each original race.

It all depends on the map. If you're in a corner with lots of planets nearby, Impossible isn't too hard. Nice neighbors helps, too. But a bad map with hostile neighbor, forget it.

For me it's always:
DO get Plasma Cannons and use only them unless i get Orion techs - then add some Death Rays
DO get to Orion first.
DO NOT spend too much time researching armor early. Zort is good enough to take Orion.
DO get Autolab as fast as possible

User avatar
Anjin
Posts:11
Joined:Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:24 pm
Location:Bay Area, California

Postby Anjin » Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:23 pm

I had similar problems with Impossible for a while, until I read the guide Cabman posted above. I broke down the guide into smaller chunks for myself so I could work on each issue seperately, and I found that simply by taking a decent race pick, following the tech path up to Robo Miners and using the housing technique I could generally out-populate and finally out-tech any AI opponent given enough time, in any galaxy size against any number of opponents. The tricky thing was when I'd get attacked earlier than I expected. This led me to read the guide more carefully.

I now think of the progression of any given game with one question in mind: when should I dive into battle technologies? In the guide he gives a few different stages of battle tech, which you can switch over to at the various stages of your empire expansion. First point is to note that you should always get the Space Academy (150 Research Points) and Battle Pods (480 Research Points) tech before building your fleet.

<Fighter Bays with Fusion Beams = 200 Research Points>
The earliest strategy, simply by having Fighters, Battle Pods and Fusion Beams you can field an early attack/defense at the sacrifice of Reinforced Hull. Not ideal though as Reinforced Hull becomes important later on.

<Full Lasers = 450 Research Points>
For this you only need Laser Beams and Battle Scanners and you can field decent Beam weaponry. What I like about this is that you can mix point defense and heavy mount to make a well-rounded Battleship.

<Full Nukes = 900 Research Points>
If you go as far as Merculite Missile in Chemistry research, you can fully modify your Nukes and do some serious damage.

<Full Fusion Beams = 1350 Research Points>
If you research as far as Neutron Scanners or Neutron Blasters, then you can fully modify Fusion Beams which believe me, these are mean. Just like Lasers you'll want Battle Scanners on your ships.

<Full Merculite Missiles = 4050 Research Points>
If you research up to Zortium Armor, you're about ready to dominate the Universe, because Zort Armor is awesome by itself, AND you can use fully modified Merculite Missiles. These are a huge jump up from every other weapon setup up until now.

User avatar
Superchad
Posts:15
Joined:Wed Feb 15, 2006 6:03 am

Postby Superchad » Fri Jun 12, 2009 8:59 pm

Honestly if you choose creative, you should never be in any real danger from the AI. Their ships are so crummy in design that a missile base will usually hold out pretty good by itself or with a little bit of support.

Are you designing your own ships? Are you actually controlling combat? With developed lasers, you can rule enemy ships until about turn 150 honestly. I've taken leftover laser BB's to Orion and Antares. One good battleship can usually hold out pretty good against 3 or 4 of theirs.

Try developing lasers to get Auto Fire, Armor Piercing and Continuous. Basically build your BB like this (very basic design)
Battle Pods, Battle Scanner, Augmented Engines. Then put a laser with the aforementioned upgrades in each slot. This allows you to choose which lasers to use for targeting and for missile defense.

Honestly, if you aren't designing and controlling your own ships, you really have no chance on impossible.
Image

User avatar
Iceman
Posts:10
Joined:Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:51 pm

Postby Iceman » Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:42 am

On normal Master of Orion II, I play Impossible using average tech level, huge galaxy, 8 opponents, and organic rich with tactical combat and Antarans attack enabled. There are actually a lot of effective strategies to employ against the AI, but I like to turtle, so I play a custom race designed to wait out the early game and come on strong after teching up to Autolabs: Democracy, Creative, Charismatic, Large Home World, Low-G, -10 Spying, and -10 Ground Combat. With this race, you will undoubtedly need good spying tech to protect your technology, but you will get all the spying tech you need before your first extremely valuable tech. Hold off your enemies with non-aggression pacts and treaties, but don't form alliances, because then you will be expected to attack other races. If there are Repulsive races near you, prepare for war. The key techs to research first are Research Labs, Automated Factories, Soil Enrichment, and Robo-Miners. After you get all of those, if you don't need to fight, just research all of the 250 RP or less fields and then go straight for Autolabs, making sure to build up a decent army of defensive spies first. Then, after gaining a few military techs, take over one reasonably-sized and somewhat scientifically advanced race of your choosing, and capture all of their colonies because you can afford to capture and protect them. If someone declares war on you, give them useless technologies like bio weapons to appease them (unless they're repulsive). In the late game, keep a defense fleet on hand and get Star Gate and Warp Interdictors. Always capture enemy colonies so that you can take advantage of their production immediately and soon after, their inherent racial advantages (you have no bonuses in farming, production, or research and you're low-G, so everyone else's people are at least as good as yours).


Return to “General Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 22 guests